The Civil War Flags Message Board

captured flags and provenance

Folks,

Ken Legendre and I have known each other for many years; same with Bob Bradley. Over that time we have all disagreed with each other with regards to flags but each discussion we have had over those flags I have saved into files as reference because others can often see things that you do not.

I will state a recent case here between Ken and I. I found in a period Ohio newspaper (Toledo, December, 1863) an account of a flag with "Warren Guards - Victory Or Death" written on the center bar (it was a First National) taken in the Chattanooga Campaign by the 3rd Ohio Cavalry. The accounts with the flag state that it was captured by the 3rd Ohio Cavalry in 1864 in Georgia. However, subsequent research into this account shows that it was for the flag of the 8th Texas Cavalry, taken in October, 1864 near Rome, GA and not the flag in question. Somehow that history got attached to this flag.

As I did the research into this flag, which can be found today in the UDC collection of the Texas Civil War Museum in Fort Worth, TX, I came up with the hypothesis that it was a Tennessee unit flag as there is a Warren County, TN. Ken challenged me on that and listed other possibilities including it being a Mississippi flag from Warren County (Vicksburg area). This flag had been an enigma to many historians including the late Howard Madaus who depicted it in his three part series of CS colors of the Trans-Mississippi for Military Collector & Historian.

So I did some more digging and found that the 16th Tennessee Infantry had four companies from Warren County - and still Ken challenged me. So I went back into the ORs some more and found the details of the cavalry raid of Col. Eli Long in whose brigade was the 3rd Ohio Cavalry.

During Grant's siege of Chattanooga and prior to his attack on Lookout Mountain/Missionary Ridge, he set off his cavalry east of the city to cut the railroad between there and Knoxville. The town of Cleveland, TN was hit by Long's Brigade who not only ripped up track but also took out the only copper rolling mill in the entire CSA. Long's troopers then hit a wagon train belonging to the CS brigade of Gen. Wright. Long and Wright both state this in their reports. Wright's Brigade had been stationed in the Cleveland area to guard bridges and the rolling mill and had very recently been ordered to Chattanooga with their wagon train to follow. Before that happened, Long's men captured it.

In looking at the units in Wrights' Brigade I found the 16th Tennessee Infantry. Looking further I found that Co. H/E was in that regiment and were named the Warren Guards!

So with this information I was able to nail shut the ID of the flag in Texas. Ken and the museum agree with me - but Ken only did so when I could place the regiment with the brigade's wagon train and the wagon train being taken by the 3rd Ohio Cavalry along with the fact that the 16th TN had a company named Warren Guards.

Ken did not anger me in this - he was doing what a good historian should be doing - asking for the proof. I finally found it - and we have another mystery cleared up thanks to his pushing me. Ken is still very much my friend and I have huge amounts of respect for his work and many years of serious flags research.

This is how it should work and how we have been looking at Ben Ford's flag and the Citadel flag as well.

Greg Biggs

Messages In This Thread

captured flags and provenance
Re: captured flags and provenance
Re: captured flags and provenance
Re: captured flags and provenance